F-22 stealth tanks and IR pod photographed

[viperzerof-2]

See: https://www.reddit.com/r/FighterJets/co ... _infrared/
and https://www.twz.com/air/f-22-spotted-wi ... -irst-pods

[darkmount]

Is it known how much they will increase the RCS?

[viperzerof-2]

Is it known how much they will increase the RCS?

Nice try Xi

[charlielima223]

Is it known how much they will increase the RCS?

Without knowing the exact performance properties of the RAM and getting some really good upclose high-res pictures... really just anyone's guess.

MY GUESS is that its frontal aspect won't be impacted so much, hence why they think it would be operationally acceptable. Definitely a different story from the side aspects but again, something they consider to be operationally acceptable. I would also wager that F-22s with those EFTs and pods would be more stealthy than an F-35 in "beast mode".

[darkmount]

Is it known how much they will increase the RCS?

Without knowing the exact performance properties of the RAM and getting some really good upclose high-res pictures... really just anyone's guess.

MY GUESS is that its frontal aspect won't be impacted so much, hence why they think it would be operationally acceptable. Definitely a different story from the side aspects but again, something they consider to be operationally acceptable. I would also wager that F-22s with those EFTs and pods would be more stealthy than an F-35 in "beast mode".

I guess it's the hardpoints that will also affect the RCS.

That said, I am worried that the sacrifice in RCS will outweigh any improvement in Range and Avionics.

As for the range, I would still prefer refuelling from the MQ-25 over any external additions to the F22.

[eloise]

Is it known how much they will increase the RCS?

Without knowing the exact performance properties of the RAM and getting some really good upclose high-res pictures... really just anyone's guess.

MY GUESS is that its frontal aspect won't be impacted so much, hence why they think it would be operationally acceptable. Definitely a different story from the side aspects but again, something they consider to be operationally acceptable. I would also wager that F-22s with those EFTs and pods would be more stealthy than an F-35 in "beast mode".

I guess it's the hardpoints that will also affect the RCS.

That said, I am worried that the sacrifice in RCS will outweigh any improvement in Range and Avionics.

As for the range, I would still prefer refuelling from the MQ-25 over any external additions to the F22.

IRST is not affected by DRFM jammer, that alone is worth the RCS increase

[disconnectedradical]

I guess it's the hardpoints that will also affect the RCS.

That said, I am worried that the sacrifice in RCS will outweigh any improvement in Range and Avionics.

As for the range, I would still prefer refuelling from the MQ-25 over any external additions to the F22.

IRST is not affected by DRFM jammer, that alone is worth the RCS increase

By the way those pods are shaped, they may not add much to RCS, or the angles that they add RCS is already in spikes anyways. Like how F-35 wingtip AIM-9X has a minimal RCS increase.

[daswp]

I guess it's the hardpoints that will also affect the RCS.

That said, I am worried that the sacrifice in RCS will outweigh any improvement in Range and Avionics.

As for the range, I would still prefer refuelling from the MQ-25 over any external additions to the F22.

I thought the MQ-25 was a basket, not a boom?

[wrightwing]

Is it known how much they will increase the RCS?

Very little. They were designed with stealth in mind.

[charlielima223]

IRST is not affected by DRFM jammer, that alone is worth the RCS increase

The inherent LPI capabilities of AESA radars are not nearly as effected by DRFM jamming as MSA pulse doppler and PESA radars. My guess is that these IRST pods will provide the F-22 with more passive detection and tracking capabilities as well as filling the target identification range between BVR radars and visual.

[eloise]

IRST is not affected by DRFM jammer, that alone is worth the RCS increase

The inherent LPI capabilities of AESA radars are not nearly as effected by DRFM jamming as MSA pulse doppler and PESA radars. My guess is that these IRST pods will provide the F-22 with more passive detection and tracking capabilities as well as filling the target identification range between BVR radars and visual.

LPI is not the unique feature of AESA radars though:
- Frequency hopping and pulse compression can be done by MSA radar
- Very low side lobes level can be achieved on PESA radar

[sprstdlyscottsmn]

The inherent LPI capabilities of AESA radars are not nearly as effected by DRFM jamming as MSA pulse doppler and PESA radars. My guess is that these IRST pods will provide the F-22 with more passive detection and tracking capabilities as well as filling the target identification range between BVR radars and visual.

And it was publicized years ago that CATBird was able to jam an F-22s radar using the early development software of the F-35. Even if no enemy has the ability to do it yet, it is only a matter of time. Adding the IRST pods will future proof this.

[darkmount]

The inherent LPI capabilities of AESA radars are not nearly as effected by DRFM jamming as MSA pulse doppler and PESA radars. My guess is that these IRST pods will provide the F-22 with more passive detection and tracking capabilities as well as filling the target identification range between BVR radars and visual.

And it was publicized years ago that CATBird was able to jam an F-22s radar using the early development software of the F-35. Even if no enemy has the ability to do it yet, it is only a matter of time. Adding the IRST pods will future proof this.

You probably mean this?

I once read an interesting fact about the APG-77v1, and that it can change its frequencies 1000 times per second!

Unfortunately, I can't find the article anymore, but if the APG-77v1 does indeed have such insane LPI features, and the older Avionics suits were able to jam it, then that shows how good the APG-81 and ASQ-239 are!


Btw, I am not aware of any similar LPI features for any eastern-made radar, whether it's the N036 or the KLJ-5, so if the latter are inferior in terms of LPI to the APG-77v1, and with the F35 receiving a substantial upgrade with the APG-85, then I don't see how the Russians or the Chinese could jam the F35.

[wrightwing]

The inherent LPI capabilities of AESA radars are not nearly as effected by DRFM jamming as MSA pulse doppler and PESA radars. My guess is that these IRST pods will provide the F-22 with more passive detection and tracking capabilities as well as filling the target identification range between BVR radars and visual.

And it was publicized years ago that CATBird was able to jam an F-22s radar using the early development software of the F-35. Even if no enemy has the ability to do it yet, it is only a matter of time. Adding the IRST pods will future proof this.

You probably mean this?

I once read an interesting fact about the APG-77v1, and that it can change its frequencies 1000 times per second!

Unfortunately, I can't find the article anymore, but if the APG-77v1 does indeed have such insane LPI features, and the older Avionics suits were able to jam it, then that shows how good the APG-81 and ASQ-239 are!


Btw, I am not aware of any similar LPI features for any eastern-made radar, whether it's the N036 or the KLJ-5, so if the latter are inferior in terms of LPI to the APG-77v1, and with the F35 receiving a substantial upgrade with the APG-85, then I don't see how the Russians or the Chinese could jam the F35.

2024 threat capabilities aren't the issue. Capabilities in the 2030s-onward are the concern being addressed.

[sprstdlyscottsmn]

exactly, if the US had that capability in the late 2000's, how many decades behind can we confidently say potentially hostile nations are? even a 20-year lead in ECM-ECCM would be run out in 5 years.